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	<title>Comments on: Four Gay and Lesbian Social Networks Coming Out &#8211; Mashable!</title>
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	<link>http://www.lagesse.org/four-gay-and-lesbian-social-networks-coming-out-mashable/</link>
	<description>&#34;A true friend stabs you in the front&#34; - Oscar Wilde</description>
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		<title>By: Paul Claessen</title>
		<link>http://www.lagesse.org/four-gay-and-lesbian-social-networks-coming-out-mashable/comment-page-1/#comment-5158</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul Claessen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Feb 2007 15:35:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lagesse.org/index.php/2007/01/08/four-gay-and-lesbian-social-networks-coming-out-mashable/#comment-5158</guid>
		<description>@Marlena  (like Rob... missed this. Excuses for late response).

a. &quot;truly transphobic comments&quot;

Not in the least! That would imply I have fear of &quot;Transgender&quot; people. I don&#039;t. Not at all. I just disapprove of the severe mutulations involved in sex-change operations. And disapprove doesn&#039;t mean I think it should be illegal: everyone will have to make that decision for him/herself.

b. &quot;Try substituting .. sexuality...etc&quot;

I tried but failed, since it completely misses my point. I have been talking about those transgender people who go to the extreme of having their biological features changed. I was not referring to crossdressers. Maybe I should have restricted myself to &#039;trans-sexuals&#039; to be more exact. Whether people can change their sexuality if they so choose .. I simply don&#039;t know. I would think so: I just read that Ted Haggart was &#039;cured&#039; and is now 100% heterosexual again. (Although he DID say that, I mention this tongue in cheek).

c. &quot;your sex is whatÃ¢â‚¬â„¢s between your legs&quot;

That&#039;s just &#039;form&#039;. It doesn&#039;t define my sex, it merely confirms it. Sex is in our chromosome make-up. Which. unlike what&#039;s between your legs, is NOT something we can change. That&#039;s why I  think the term &#039;sex-change-operation&#039; is a horrible misnomer.

d. &quot;imagine you woke up one morning with breasts and vagina instead of a penis&quot; &quot;steps to regain one [penis]&quot;.

Imagine the moon would fall to earth... It&#039;s a silly (slippery slope) argument. But okay, I&#039;ll play along:
My whole point was, that if I would wakeup without a penis, I would NOT TAKE steps to regain one. If I woke up with (real!) breasts and a vagina .. I would have some fun with them!

Just for the record: I&#039;m ALSO not homophobic.
Also: many crossdressers don&#039;t consider themselves transgender.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Marlena  (like Rob&#8230; missed this. Excuses for late response).</p>
<p>a. &#8220;truly transphobic comments&#8221;</p>
<p>Not in the least! That would imply I have fear of &#8220;Transgender&#8221; people. I don&#8217;t. Not at all. I just disapprove of the severe mutulations involved in sex-change operations. And disapprove doesn&#8217;t mean I think it should be illegal: everyone will have to make that decision for him/herself.</p>
<p>b. &#8220;Try substituting .. sexuality&#8230;etc&#8221;</p>
<p>I tried but failed, since it completely misses my point. I have been talking about those transgender people who go to the extreme of having their biological features changed. I was not referring to crossdressers. Maybe I should have restricted myself to &#8216;trans-sexuals&#8217; to be more exact. Whether people can change their sexuality if they so choose .. I simply don&#8217;t know. I would think so: I just read that Ted Haggart was &#8216;cured&#8217; and is now 100% heterosexual again. (Although he DID say that, I mention this tongue in cheek).</p>
<p>c. &#8220;your sex is whatÃ¢â‚¬â„¢s between your legs&#8221;</p>
<p>That&#8217;s just &#8216;form&#8217;. It doesn&#8217;t define my sex, it merely confirms it. Sex is in our chromosome make-up. Which. unlike what&#8217;s between your legs, is NOT something we can change. That&#8217;s why I  think the term &#8216;sex-change-operation&#8217; is a horrible misnomer.</p>
<p>d. &#8220;imagine you woke up one morning with breasts and vagina instead of a penis&#8221; &#8220;steps to regain one [penis]&#8220;.</p>
<p>Imagine the moon would fall to earth&#8230; It&#8217;s a silly (slippery slope) argument. But okay, I&#8217;ll play along:<br />
My whole point was, that if I would wakeup without a penis, I would NOT TAKE steps to regain one. If I woke up with (real!) breasts and a vagina .. I would have some fun with them!</p>
<p>Just for the record: I&#8217;m ALSO not homophobic.<br />
Also: many crossdressers don&#8217;t consider themselves transgender.</p>
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		<title>By: rob</title>
		<link>http://www.lagesse.org/four-gay-and-lesbian-social-networks-coming-out-mashable/comment-page-1/#comment-5121</link>
		<dc:creator>rob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Feb 2007 05:02:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lagesse.org/index.php/2007/01/08/four-gay-and-lesbian-social-networks-coming-out-mashable/#comment-5121</guid>
		<description>Mariena - I have no doubt I&#039;ve met some of you (and I apologize, but your comment was stuck somewhere for way to long - I finally found and released it today).

Honestly, I don&#039;t care if Gay, Transgender, Lesbian, Straight or even Soccer Moms like me - I&#039;m not here to gain anyone&#039;s approval. But I honestly didn&#039;t have ANY clue what the &quot;T&quot; stood for - and perhaps my &quot;do I want to know&quot; statement could be seen as negative (but gernerally only by overly sensitive people, I would think).

I do appreciate the sensitivity of this though - I see how many hits this post gets.  Evidently there is a lot of interest in the topic.

And me?  I still don&#039;t give a shit what you are if you are a good friend and decent human being.  If you are a straight asshole you are still an asshole.  And if you are a transgender asshole you to are still an asshole.

I&#039;m color blind when it comes to friends - why shouldn&#039;t I be sexual-bias blind as well?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mariena &#8211; I have no doubt I&#8217;ve met some of you (and I apologize, but your comment was stuck somewhere for way to long &#8211; I finally found and released it today).</p>
<p>Honestly, I don&#8217;t care if Gay, Transgender, Lesbian, Straight or even Soccer Moms like me &#8211; I&#8217;m not here to gain anyone&#8217;s approval. But I honestly didn&#8217;t have ANY clue what the &#8220;T&#8221; stood for &#8211; and perhaps my &#8220;do I want to know&#8221; statement could be seen as negative (but gernerally only by overly sensitive people, I would think).</p>
<p>I do appreciate the sensitivity of this though &#8211; I see how many hits this post gets.  Evidently there is a lot of interest in the topic.</p>
<p>And me?  I still don&#8217;t give a shit what you are if you are a good friend and decent human being.  If you are a straight asshole you are still an asshole.  And if you are a transgender asshole you to are still an asshole.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m color blind when it comes to friends &#8211; why shouldn&#8217;t I be sexual-bias blind as well?</p>
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		<title>By: Marlena Dahlstrom</title>
		<link>http://www.lagesse.org/four-gay-and-lesbian-social-networks-coming-out-mashable/comment-page-1/#comment-4081</link>
		<dc:creator>Marlena Dahlstrom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Feb 2007 05:20:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lagesse.org/index.php/2007/01/08/four-gay-and-lesbian-social-networks-coming-out-mashable/#comment-4081</guid>
		<description>Rob, I think the problem wasn&#039;t you asking the question -- but the bit about &quot;Or do I not want to know?&quot; But I&#039;m willing to overlook some insensitivity -- it&#039;s a far cry from the truly transphobic comments from Paul. (Try substituting &quot;no matter how much some people would like to choose their sexuality, they simply can&#039;t....&quot; Your gay friends would probably be pissed off, yes? BTW, Paul, your sex is what&#039;s between your legs, gender is what&#039;s between your ears... But just imagine you woke up one morning with breasts and vagina instead of a penis. Somehow I doubt that you&#039;d view taking steps to regain one as &quot;mutilation....&quot;

Incidentally, Rob, the &quot;T&quot; doesn&#039;t stand for transsexual, it stands for &quot;transgender,&quot; an umbrella term that refers to people whose biological and gender identity or expression may not be the same. This can include preoperative, postoperative or nonoperative transsexuals, female and male crossdressers, drag queens or kings, and female or male impersonators. For example, a hetro guy like me who enjoys being the girl next door some of the time. Even though by some estimates as many as 1 in 20 men engage in some form of crossdressing, you haven&#039;t heard of us because we crossdressers are the most closeted group of all. Imagine what it&#039;s like to have to hide part of who you are, even from those closest to you. That&#039;s what it&#039;s like for most of my peers. And you _have_ met us. Trust me, you&#039;ve met us.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rob, I think the problem wasn&#8217;t you asking the question &#8212; but the bit about &#8220;Or do I not want to know?&#8221; But I&#8217;m willing to overlook some insensitivity &#8212; it&#8217;s a far cry from the truly transphobic comments from Paul. (Try substituting &#8220;no matter how much some people would like to choose their sexuality, they simply can&#8217;t&#8230;.&#8221; Your gay friends would probably be pissed off, yes? BTW, Paul, your sex is what&#8217;s between your legs, gender is what&#8217;s between your ears&#8230; But just imagine you woke up one morning with breasts and vagina instead of a penis. Somehow I doubt that you&#8217;d view taking steps to regain one as &#8220;mutilation&#8230;.&#8221;</p>
<p>Incidentally, Rob, the &#8220;T&#8221; doesn&#8217;t stand for transsexual, it stands for &#8220;transgender,&#8221; an umbrella term that refers to people whose biological and gender identity or expression may not be the same. This can include preoperative, postoperative or nonoperative transsexuals, female and male crossdressers, drag queens or kings, and female or male impersonators. For example, a hetro guy like me who enjoys being the girl next door some of the time. Even though by some estimates as many as 1 in 20 men engage in some form of crossdressing, you haven&#8217;t heard of us because we crossdressers are the most closeted group of all. Imagine what it&#8217;s like to have to hide part of who you are, even from those closest to you. That&#8217;s what it&#8217;s like for most of my peers. And you _have_ met us. Trust me, you&#8217;ve met us.</p>
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		<title>By: Paul Claessen</title>
		<link>http://www.lagesse.org/four-gay-and-lesbian-social-networks-coming-out-mashable/comment-page-1/#comment-1720</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul Claessen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Jan 2007 15:22:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lagesse.org/index.php/2007/01/08/four-gay-and-lesbian-social-networks-coming-out-mashable/#comment-1720</guid>
		<description>&quot;be whatever gender you want to be&quot;

If asking what the T stands for already outrages people (I&#039;m less friendly than you towards such people: get a life!), then my comment to the above quote is probably going to get me killed: My response to it is:

No matter how much some people would like to choose their gender, they simply can&#039;t.
Sure, you can try to change the way you present yourself (in clothing, speech and mannerism), you can influence some hormone driven bodily functions and you can even have your body &#039;sculptured&#039; (mutilated!) by undergoing so called sex-change operations (a horrible misnomer), but none of it will change your gender. Having your penis removed and have the resulting wound manipulated into resembling a vagina, doesn&#039;t make you a woman. A simple chromosome check (XX or XY) determines your sex, not the way you look.
SO, yes, may be I AM an anti-trans-genderist. Having your body mutilated and chopped up because you always wanted to be a man/woman...and are living in agony because you&#039;re a man/woman, to me, is coming pretty close to justifying other &#039;not-widely-accepted&#039; practices, because you &#039;always wanted to be rich&#039; and live in agony being poor. It&#039;s like trying to take a short-cut out of what you perceive as unpleasant or even misery .. and seldom has the anticipated result. We ALL have been dealt hands that we didn&#039;t like... try to make something with that 5-6 offsuit. Trying to masquerade it as a pair of Aces isn&#039;t going to guarantee you a winner.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;be whatever gender you want to be&#8221;</p>
<p>If asking what the T stands for already outrages people (I&#8217;m less friendly than you towards such people: get a life!), then my comment to the above quote is probably going to get me killed: My response to it is:</p>
<p>No matter how much some people would like to choose their gender, they simply can&#8217;t.<br />
Sure, you can try to change the way you present yourself (in clothing, speech and mannerism), you can influence some hormone driven bodily functions and you can even have your body &#8216;sculptured&#8217; (mutilated!) by undergoing so called sex-change operations (a horrible misnomer), but none of it will change your gender. Having your penis removed and have the resulting wound manipulated into resembling a vagina, doesn&#8217;t make you a woman. A simple chromosome check (XX or XY) determines your sex, not the way you look.<br />
SO, yes, may be I AM an anti-trans-genderist. Having your body mutilated and chopped up because you always wanted to be a man/woman&#8230;and are living in agony because you&#8217;re a man/woman, to me, is coming pretty close to justifying other &#8216;not-widely-accepted&#8217; practices, because you &#8216;always wanted to be rich&#8217; and live in agony being poor. It&#8217;s like trying to take a short-cut out of what you perceive as unpleasant or even misery .. and seldom has the anticipated result. We ALL have been dealt hands that we didn&#8217;t like&#8230; try to make something with that 5-6 offsuit. Trying to masquerade it as a pair of Aces isn&#8217;t going to guarantee you a winner.</p>
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